Welcome back, guys. Today, I have Mariana on with us. And did I pronounce your name correctly? Yes, beautifully. All right. And she is a procrastination and focus coach, but I’m going to turn it over to her to let her introduce herself. Thank you, Mande. Hi, everybody. My name is Mariana Fávero Bonesso , so I am a procrastination and focus coach and since 2016, I’ve been helping people either overcome procrastination or change their habits.

And mostly bring their creative ideas to life. And after transitioning from my postdoc, I earned my first professional and personal leadership coaching certification. And then I went through several other certifications. And now I have success fully guided clients to go from flashing cursor on the screen to an effortless first draft as a procrastination and focus coach. Well, I’m sure that’s going to spark the ears of a lot of my audience because I have a whole lot of creatives, you know, working with people with ADHD.

And it’s my understanding you’re one of us, right? You have ADHD as well. Yes. I recently last year met the criteria for ADD. Yes. Okay. So you would be considered inattentive, is that correct? Yeah, that’s it. Okay. All right. And that’s the difference for those of you that don’t know. When you hear people say ADD, usually that means inattentive.

It’s not on the M5. Now, we all we all fall under ADHD, whether you’re hyperactive, combined or inattentive. But when you hear used, it’s usually inattentive. So, you know, you know what type of brain you’re you’re talking to. But we before this recording, we’re talking and I was really interested in something that you said about there being different types of procrastination and you said you got it from the book succeeding with adult ADHD, which I have not read.

I thought I read them all, so I’m super excited to jump into that after my meetings today. But can you tell us about the different types of procrastination? Absolutely. I love how Dr. Abigail live, Renee. I hope I’m not. But during her name I probably am. She talks about this four different types, which is forgetful, distracted, big picture and perfectionistic, so forgetful.

For a lot of us, this is very much this is very common, especially for people with poor working memory. But it’s typically when you go like, wait, what task or wait, what do I need to do? That’s the forgetful type. The distracted type are usually the people who have a difficult time managing their desires to check their phone or to get up from your desk and getting something more fun to do.

The big picture people, which is me, it’s the people who have difficulty breaking down the steps to achieve a bigger goal. So, for example, I want to lose 10 Pounds or when I run a marathon, but they get easily overwhelmed with the amount out or the big picture of 10K instead of no. Today I need to run 500 meters in 2 minutes or so in order for me to build to that ability in the perfectionistic type is the perfectionistic type is those people who have a high standard to achieve a goal have a fear of failure.

And it typically sounds like if I had more time, I can do this very, very well. So then I might as well not even get started. So those are the types that I hope. I hope that you can see yourself in one or multiple of them because sometimes you might be the forgetful type for one of your goals, but sometimes you might be on the big picture for one of your goals.

So then those frame of mind or those perspectives might be symptomatic of your type of ADHD. And I can see falling into all four of those categories in different ways.

but on the 12 week year challenge, I’m in round two of offering the 12 week year challenge. And what I did is I just opened it up for those that are familiar with the 12 week year. I opened it up to have basically anybody that wanted to join me, join me for weekly accountability meetings.

And what I tell them is like, you have to have the breakdown of your goals in your face. You cannot put it away somewhere. It can’t be just locked in your phone, like put it put it somewhere digitally, but also put it somewhere where it’s very much in your face so that you can’t forget. And I see with that goal I can fall into like the forgetful category often.

But yeah, so

let’s jump into focus. Tell me tell me how you talk about focus with your clients. Yeah. So for kids, the way that I see focus, Mande in every one listening is might be a little bit different than how you might conceptualize it.

I see focus as a behavior versus something that simply happens to us. And

So the way to be like talking about focus is focus is a behavior which might different differ from all the ways that people see focus as if it’s something that simply happens, right?

So when I when I’m teaching about focus, I teach them. I teach them this three main things that has to happen in order for us to focus effectively. The first one is a decision We have to decide what matters most in this moment and what does it matter for this particular moment. So, for example, if I am working towards creating five pieces of content for instagram and linked, for example, because I cross pollinate them.

So in this next hour or 2 hours block, that is my end goal toward this 2 hours. So my first decision has to be what matters most in order for me to get that thing done. That’s the decision. The second part of it is going to be managing urges. So urges for me to just go on Instagram and endlessly research search in quotes for research what others are saying or how others are doing and what would be best for me.

So I have to make a decision if I am if I have all of those, the information that I need right now in order for me to accomplish that, that those five pieces of content and then manage the urges to do anything else and I’m not saying go to the bed from right like those urges I think we have to most likely honor Right.

But this is not an urge to distract, but it’s a normal biological urge and managing distractions for me, I have to have my earbuds in. I have to have an environment where it’s quiet enough for my brain to to have like one line of thinking. It even is still my brain will go back and forth. It’s just like meditation, right?

Like I decided to sit in meditation and my brain will go and distract. But then my goal is to be able to bring it back gently, right? Like we don’t have to use willpower. Notice that is going and then we bring it back. And then once we have those three three things in place, we’re able to create focus.

So focus becomes a behavior that you can train when you have the tools to allow for that kind. Yeah, you were mentioning urges there, and it made me think I’ve worked with so many clients about this where, you know, we set specific times for things to happen and they get frustrated because they want to go and do something else.

One thing I think of is I have an app that I use now that has been helping me so much with my workouts, but as a personal hyperactive person with ADHD, when I’m weight training, for example, I get really bored and I want to do anything else besides work out and I own the gym, so my office is just right there, steps away.

I can just disappear into my office and do some paperwork or, you know, do something else. But one thing that was really helpful that I think goes along with what you’re saying is and I share this with my clients, which is reminding myself, you know, making the decision, number one, that this is what I’m doing. I’m working out right now and remind myself that there is nothing else I need to be doing right now when I have that urge to go away from from the workout right.

my gosh, that’s so beautiful. And I’m glad that you brought this up, because it’s very common for people to have conflicting priorities. Right. And when we make a decision, this is the only thing that I need to do right now, you allow your brain to you still want to do the other thing, whatever it is, which is also important.

But then you start gently teaching it that, right now this is the time to do this. And you also teach yourself to refocus in the moment. So I think it’s a beautiful example. It has such a calming effect on me, and I hope that that translates with my clients to where you like. Just reminding yourself with that thought, there’s nothing else you’re supposed to be doing right now, not in a punishing way, but just in a way where it’s like you are doing exactly what you need to be doing right now.

You’re right on track. Even though our brain wants to tell us, like there are all these other things we could be doing. But I love your conversation around urges as far as there is a thing called environmental hyperfocus. And I don’t. It’s a terrible name for it. But what I like to call it is pin balling. It’s like you’re a ball in a pinball machine and you’re kind of bouncing around to all the different things.

And but what I tell people that there that come to me frustrated that they’re doing this and what that might look like is for me, it used to be I’m going to get dressed and then I would go, okay, I don’t have the shirt that I want to wear. It’s in the laundry room. And so I’m on my way to the laundry room and now I’ve gone six or seven different places and done ten different things to zero.

Some capacity, but not to completion. And I’m still not dressed and it’s 2:00 and I’m sweaty. You know, that was kind of how my day would would end up going. And it was so frustrating. But what I share with people is like, you’re simply getting an urge to do something to pick up the thing that goes into the bathroom and put it there and you’re just answering the urge.

And what we need to do is have the urge but not answer the urge at that time. And I think that kind of goes really well with the conversation that you’re having about about focus. Absolutely. This reminds me of like a technique that someone can use in this moment whenever they have that urge. Just calling, just naming it as an urge.

I’m having an urge to pick this up. To put it in the bathroom is enough for them to detach a little bit and to diffuse a little bit of that urgent feel that we get that we’re training ourselves to respond to. So that creates a little bit of softness for you to be like, okay, yeah, this is a load.

I don’t have to respond that right now because this is not as important as getting dressed and then moving myself to whatever it is that I want to get on time. So then it creates a little bit of space for you to have a different conversation. And I think to having a coach like you, that helps them create a new line of conversation in practice during the session, it’s so important for moments like that so they can retrain their focus and go back to where they want to go back now.

But also,

like I think it’s important that we we identified that as in the church, like that’s the first step. And I think that a lot of people can see themselves in that because I could also see myself. I did that this morning. I was like, I was just cleaning out the kitchen when they wanted to sit here and prepared the script for me to talk to you today.

It was like, okay, that’s that’s what’s happening. We’re going to go back and we’re going to sit down and we’re going to have fun. Yeah, yeah. And creating space you mentioned and, and that’s for those of you that are like, yes, I’m not pinball. I am just following every urge. What’s happening there is the urge happens and we automatically follow it.

And when you start doing, you know, when you work with coaches like myself and Marianna, you start to you become more aware of your thinking and your feelings and your actions. And that puts basically like a pause or a space between having the urge, which oftentimes is just thinking, I need to go take care of this. And when you have that space, you can recognize, there’s the thoughts.

I don’t have to answer it immediately where some of you that might be new to this work might just think that these urges are just happening to you and you have to follow them. But the more we can create that space and create the awareness, I always tell people there’s like stages of awareness. First, all your thoughts are just happening to you and then you stage two is you’re aware of them and now you’re judging them.

And stage three is you’re aware of them and you’re accepted. And stage three is where I’m trying to get everybody to be. And especially when you have ADHD behavior, sometimes you can just get frustrated with yourself and that’s something I thought it was important to talk about is I have a lot of people come to me frustrated at their lack of focus or frustrated that they’re trying to focus and and they’re getting distracted.

What would you say to people like that? Yeah, and that’s a very common emotion for people to have along with shame. Right? Because then I like to remind people that whenever we’re feeling frustrated first, that’s a very normal response. And second, often times the frustration comes because we expecting the focus simply being there, just like, I just expect myself to be inspired you to write something.

Right?

So when we think the focus simply happened, we forget that we have so much more agency on how the focus, how to respond to the quote unquote lack of focus, right?

So we forget to put in place the tools, which is the side manage urges and prepare for distractions so you can have that focus or the flow that you’re looking for to create whatever it is that you want to create. Right? So if you remember, remind yourself that you have agency of how you respond to your brain, even though that might be a stretch at this point, at this moment.

And that’s okay. But that’s a new idea considered that it’s possible that you have a lot of agency of how you’re going to respond to how your brain is presenting all the urges and all those thoughts. And when you consider that as a possibility, you have a little window for you to a little window, a little door for you to looking to.

How might I respond to this urges that I have introduced to this, all of the thoughts that I’m having in a way that allows for full cues to be sharpened by what is in my control, to help my brain to focus. That’s sometimes a question that I like to give myself, especially like in like today that I didn’t sleep very well and I have to and I want to perform in on my day in a way that produces it at the same time that I meet myself, where am I?

So I prepare for all of those conditions to not be perfect, because I that’s another tendency that I have, but I can still focus to the best of my ability. And I love that we we talked about before the call, we talked about coaching certification and when when I was going through coaching certification, they gave us they would mail us these big thick books.

And I had Catherine Green as the person that was leading my group. She’s a coach, fantastic coach, very serene. She’s just she’s so amazing to work with. Just her calm. But I remember bringing to Catherine the fact that I felt like I did not absorb information, and especially when I when I saw those big books, that’s immediately what it triggered.

It triggered back to college when I would get the big text books and I would try to study and then I would go to perform on the test. And it didn’t seem like any of the information sunk in. And so I had all the evidence that this was true, and she helped me understand that it was actually my thought process that was distracting me from focusing on the reading.

And what would happen is I would think I’m not going to absorb this information. And I explain to people that it’s kind of like a hamster on a wheel and the hamsters running on the wheel. And the information that you’re trying to bring in is like sunflower seeds that you’re trying to throw into the for the hamster. But it’s like getting thrown out by the wheel.

And the wheel was my thoughts and like my negative thinking about how this study was going to end up. And she helped me with a thought which was helping me come to this thought, which was, I’m going to get all the information that I need. And just that thought, as soon as I would get the practice thought of like I’m not going to absorb the information and I would lose focus that thought of I’m going to get everything I need from this helped me to calm down.

That helped stop the chatter and helped me not be distracted by my thinking and really focus on the information. And I did. I did quite well in coaching certification, and I think it was because of that coaching that really helped me focus. Do you experience things like that with your clients? Definitely. And that’s a very common theme for clients because either they have the ADHD like symptoms or they were diagnosed with ADHD.

And that thought is it’s like a self-fulfilling prophecy, right? So I ignored Gar too, right? So it’s like and then you have another thought that is a self-fulfilling prophecy, but it actually serves you and helps you drive your focus so much better because you can find evidences for both. Got and that which one are you going to focus more of your efforts spread that will create or derive the results that you want or the the consequences that you want.

So I think that ultimately it’s like effective strategies to help with procrastination often include not only tips and tools to help you manage time, but also use your ability to manage your mindset around your own abilities to remember things and absorb information in, sharpen your focus or manage your time even right. Because our thoughts are very our mindset is very important for us to either build the skills or strengthening the skills that we need or keep them as they are right now.

So the way that we’re thinking about them matters so much. Absolutely. Whenever people come to me and they’re they’re complaining about memory issues, the first thing I’m looking to is like, What are you thinking? And how is that thinking stressing you out? And with people with ADHD, as soon as our stress levels get high, and if we’re making ourselves stressed with our thinking, your your memory is trash after that.

So that’s the first place I look whenever they say I have a working memory issues or I don’t absorb information like I was saying, that’s all. It’s all memory stuff. But one important thing that I really want to make sure we touch on today is you talked about identifying as a procrastinator. Talk to us about that. So typically people come to me, they say I’m a procrastinator, I’m an 80% person, and that is the first thing that I help them create some flexibility around, because that means to me that they’re looking at their behavior and they are identifying themselves with their actions.

And one of the biggest forces in human personality is our identity, because we’re going to want to be consistent with that. So every single behavior that you’re going to be looking at from the identity of a procrastination procrastinator is going to be a procrastination themed or colored right. And that is not very helpful because it keeps you from really understanding yourself at a deeper level.

What are the the behaviors that actually help me regulate down and regulate up in order for me to get things done right? So maybe you’re very confused here working at your computer, but when you go out there, clean your kitchen, at a certain point, you start feeling better. But if you see yourself as a procrastinator, you might not stop yourself a certain point and come back because you’re going to see that as a procrastination behavior and not as this is a tool for me, right?

So once you start seeing procrastination as a nation is a behavior. I’m someone who procrastinate sometimes instead of I’m a procrastinator, then you can start looking at those behaviors and getting this data to facilitate regulating your nervous system or regulating your emotions in a way that actually helps you come back into the work that you want to be doing in a very kind way.

Not ashamed based way, which is very coherent when you’re identifying yourself with those behaviors that you deem not very good now. And when the difference I’m hearing there is when you are a procrastinator, there is no longer anything you can do about it. Your mind is closed to any way that you can make any changes towards it, because that’s just who I am.

But when you identify your actions that what you said, I don’t know if you said it right now, but what you said before the call is some times I procrastinate and I’m like, well, that opens up the world to if I only procrastinate. Sometimes there are times that I don’t procrastinate. How is that true? How can I find that evidence and carry that forward?

And so it’s just so much more open tonight. I love talking about identity. I want to do a whole podcast about identity because it helped me so much with my anxiety, and it was when I was going through certification, there was some coaching done where I just realized I identified as an anxious person, and by identifying that way, there was nothing I could do about it except take medication and suffer over being anxious.

But once I realized I was just identifying that way, it took away like 50% of my anxiety in that moment. And because I and I had agency over it. But we’re out of time for today. I would love to talk to Marianna all day long, but we are out of time for today and I have another meeting. But I want you to tell people where can they find you?

What would you like to share? Yes. First of all, thank you so much for having me, Minde and everybody. I’m so grateful for the opportunity to connect. And you can find me on Instagram at Maria and the underscore f one there. So and on my bio you’ll find some resources, some free resources, like the trees that three step productivity processes for high achieving procrastination way you can download and make it yours.

Very good. Very good. All right. Well, thank you so much for being here today. I appreciate it. Thank you for having me. I appreciate you, too.